Offering a slight damper / correction:

This is about two things (design and ownership), which are correlated, but not identical.

Malicious design can be things like:

• Algorithms to keep people engaged
• UIs to confuse users (luring them to purchases, or making ‘cancel’ hard to access)
• Using intermediate currencies to make it harder to assert value
• …

Obviously, these patterns and practices can also be applied to a FOSS instance you own. There is less incentive to do so if the profit motive is removed - which makes a huge difference.

These design patterns are fundamentally about making user numbers go up. Attract more users, keep them on your platform longer, make them leave less. And a portion of user guidance mixed in. None of that is inherently evil, to some degree even desireable, and to some extent unavoidable to offer a functional service.

Some users may expect a feed like lemmy to browse indefinitely, since they find it inconvenient to have to click to go to the ‘next page’. And because they got used to this feature elsewhere. Others already see this as a dark pattern.

I just wanted to highlight how some of the malicious stuff may still be present in the fediverse, without any company involved. Here, we’re kind of in charge on both sides: Each is responsible for their own user agency (like controlling your online hours, or what sites you visit), and collectively to decide what user experience we want to shape (which might include controverse patterns).

I spent way too many words on this. Mostly I agree with you! And overall, users will encounter far less malicious patterns on FOSS.

[Edit: Formatting]

An (intuitively) working search would be a great step ahead. It should find and show things if they exist, and only show no results if they do not. That a plethora of external tools exist to meet these basic needs shows both how much this is needed, and how much it is broken.

I also feel I have more luck finding communities if searching for ‘all’, instead of ‘communities’. Don’t make me add cryptic chars to my search to make it work. Do that for me in the background if necessary.

It’s been long since I’ve been using it, but iirc, it’s impossible or painful to search for a specific community in your subscribed list.

From the title, I had a question and found the answer in the FAQ:

What’s an unconference?

An unconference is a conference in which the participants – rather than the organizers – decide which sessions happen each day and on which topics. In the many years we have been organizing unconferences, we have found that for complex subjects like the Fediverse, attendees get more value (and fun!) out of unconferences than from traditional conferences. Sounds disorganized? It did to us, too, until we actually experienced our first one. So don’t worry, it will be fine :-)

Here are some suggestions for how to prepare for an unconference.

And this is another issue which hinders discoverability. It’s nice there are tools and workarounds but their existence also signals the issue exists.

I didn’t say able to locate I said there being a list.

Are you confusing comments?

I see this in the referred comment:

having the capability to locate

While the word “list” does not appear.

But mostly I think we should try to read the message, not focus on single words.

Exactly this. It’s often about finding the right balance between technically optimal, and socially feasible (lacking the right phrase here).

The nerds brimming with technical expertise often neglect the second point.

Oh - wow! I was about to complain about how https://join-lemmy.org/ is a shining bad example in this regard, talking about server stuff right away and hiding how Lemmy actually looks until page 3, but apparently they changed that and improved it drastically. Cool, good job!

Anyways.

For collaborative projects especially, it is important to strike a balance between tech and social aspects. Making poor tech choices will put people off. But making your project less accessible will also result in less people joining. It’s crucial to find a good balance here. For many coming from the tech side, this usually means making far more concessions to the social side than intuitively feels right.

I find the plateau quite puzzling (lemmy.world, but the total looks very similar):

There was quite a steep increase, and then it suddenly stopped.

I would rather expect it to slow down, than to stop that abruptly.

We’re looking at a fairly large group of people making a decision to create an account on Lemmy. There are plenty of reasons to expect it to be fuzzy. Even if they all responded to one particular event in time, some would have done so immediately, others the next day, few more even later.

Yes, that’s true, but the number probably actually declined for a similar reason.

Some created multiple accounts, others tried multiple platforms. Some were happy with lemmy and stayed, others did not.

Right, it does display a karma value in the user profile page (not my own, but for others). Regardless from which instance that user is.

It does not display user karma in threads, regardless on which instance. Does your experience differ?

Lemmy.ml Karma Calculator

Display Lemmy.ml Karma.

Seems to not be so useful outside of lemmy.ml

Reddit was using karma for a long time and people stayed. The exodus happened when reddit announced charging for using their API, and everything that came along. Karma was no significant part of that story.

When people “farm” for fake internet pointe by appealing to the oppinions of everyone else it leads to people just expressing one “right” (popular) oppinion.

We have the same result already, for several reasons. One is, we do have karma within threads.

Another is, people will get backlash for voicing the “wrong” opinion even if there is no point system. People happily reply to correct someone.

In any case, performance is just one factor. For a FOSS project to be successful long term it needs contributions from other developers and with the massive pool of Python developers there are, hopefully I’ll be getting some help soon. Also along those lines I have deliberately chosen:

to code as simply and stupidly as possible, to make it accessible to most skill levels.
No complicated frameworks, fancy algorithms, or esoteric design patterns. Model View Controller, baby.
No frontend build process or tool chain (vanilla JS only. No npm).
Few third party dependencies, only Redis and Postgresql. Mostly.

All this makes setting up an initial development environment, finding the bit you want to change and testing it out fairly quick and easy.

Sounds very wise to make it as accessible as possible. And you basically get super maintainable code as a side product!

That wasn’t clear to me. I thought this was about siloed lemmy instances, hence I talked about that.

I don’t see how their comment makes sense from your perspective. Can you explain? According to that theory, where did the exploding-heads people go, joining the people who can’t handle living in a mixed society in real life? Do you mean they stopped using the internet or how does that help to explain the observation?

I’m trying, that’s why I’m asking!

Yeah, I guess both can be true. Maybe you have a better approach.

The interesting part is not your personal opinion but the reasoning behind it.

I have reasons for my position and layed them out. You disagree, and showed that much. I still have my reasons and can’t know yours, so your comment did not change anyones mind or advance the conversation in any way.

Ruud is categorically suppressing or deleting certain viewpoints or speakers? Or some other Lemmy admin is doing so? Can you give an example?

It’s fairly easy to get banned on lemmygrad for having a (perceived) liberal attitude, to name the obvious example.

‘people who can’t handle living in a mixed society’

That’s … both sides, all sides, isn’t it? Specifically for exploding-heads, there were numerous and loud calls on multiple instances to defederate from them.

Hello! Funny that you still wiggle. Have you always been so emotional?

Anyways, my actual question for clarification is: What does ‘cz’ mean?